\n<\/p>\n
A<\/span>lmost 30 years ago, not long after the final episode of This Life, the BBC series that launched Daniela Nardini\u2019s career, I interviewed her at a swanky hotel in Covent Garden, London. I had expected her to be exactly like her This Life character, Anna Forbes, the provocatively sharp and messy woman now being credited by critics as the prototype for Fleabag. She did not disappoint. My memory of that encounter remains vivid: a giddy hour covering love, ambition, sex and fame. She wore a pink lily in her hair, and wine might have been consumed.<\/p>\n Nardini now lives and works as a therapist in the West End of Glasgow. As I stroll through the tenement-lined streets to interview her, there are other reasons I\u2019m ruminating on the past. In the short walk from the subway, I pass my first home, my nursery and my primary school (now inevitably repurposed as luxury flats). I am getting timewarp vibes at every turn, but the sensation evaporates when Nardini comes to the door. The woman on the threshold has a very different demeanour from the one inhabiting my memory. She remains striking, with the same soft, dark gaze. But what is most compelling is her unsmiling stillness.<\/p>\n There is an awkward formality as she ushers me into her consulting room. The space is filled with plants and zen art. Gesturing for me to sit in what is presumably the therapy armchair, she offers coffee and within moments is deftly extracting my life story. For one stricken moment I wonder if she thinks I am her next patient. In an attempt to wrest back control, I blurt out a question I had been intending to leave until much later. \u201cDo your therapy clients ever seek you out because of This Life?\u201d<\/p>\n A look of astonishment flits across her face. \u201cThat just hasn\u2019t happened!\u201d<\/p>\n I tell her that I\u2019m surprised, particularly when she mentions that most of her clients are women, many in midlife.<\/p>\n \u201cWell, in a therapeutic environment, you\u2019re having a conversation about real stuff, and some of it\u2019s dark and some of it\u2019s difficult, and it\u2019s about helping a person to find the best way through it. A couple of people have mentioned that they\u2019ve maybe seen me in something, but I downplay it.\u201d<\/p>\n <\/span>Nardini (second right) with Andrew Lincoln, Amita Dhiri, Jason Hughes and Jack Davenport in This Life.<\/span> Photograph: Moviestore Collection Ltd\/Alamy<\/p>\n At its peak, when people would rush home from the pub to catch the next episode of This Life on BBC Two, the show had 3.5 million viewers. Nardini\u2019s character resonated with a generation of young women who found themselves floundering while trying to make their way in the work-hard, play-hard professional milieu of late-90s Britain. Her bravado, her swearing, her wildly confident sexuality all chimed perfectly with those Cool Britannia times.<\/p>\n Nardini had discovered acting at school, before going to drama school in Glasgow and getting parts in the Scottish soap Take the High Road, the TV adaptation of John Byrne\u2019s Your Cheatin\u2019 Heart and, inevitably, Taggart, in which she played a detective. She also acted in several fringe theatre productions, including the title role in the Liz Lochhead play Mary Queen of Scots Got Her Head Chopped Off. The following year, 1995, she heard a rumour that This Life was seeking a Scottish actor to play Anna. She didn\u2019t think she stood a chance. But, as fate would have it, Lochhead was asked if she could recommend anyone and Nardini was called for audition.<\/p>\n \u201cIt was crazy, really, because This Life was such an instant success,\u201d says Nardini, beaming at the memory. \u201cIt provided me with lots of opportunities. But at the time, I had moved down [to London] from Scotland and I found it all quite overwhelming. I\u2019m a family girl and I missed everyone back home.\u201d<\/p>\n When the series was abruptly cancelled after two seasons, Nardini found it hard to shake off the character, for which she earned a Bafta in 1998. \u201cCasting directors kept asking: \u2018Can you do her<\/em> again, but in a different way?\u2019 The only way to really break out was to do theatre. Then slowly, as I got older, things changed anyway. I started playing mothers and different kinds of parts.\u201d As well as numerous theatre roles, she went on to win a Scottish Bafta for her role as a ruthless estate agent in Annie Griffin\u2019s New Town in 2009.<\/p>\n She expresses surprise when I tell her about the comparisons to Phoebe Waller-Bridge. \u201cReally? I\u2019ve never watched Fleabag.\u201d<\/p>\n Seven years ago, Nardini made the decision to retrain as a therapist. However, you couldn\u2019t call it anything as simple as a \u201cpivot\u201d.<\/p>\n \u201cTherapy has always been something I\u2019ve been interested in, and, well \u2026,\u201d she breaks off, looking sheepish. \u201cActors always lie about their age. My younger brother says he gets confused about what age he is, because I\u2019ve always taken a couple of years off mine. I\u2019m having a big birthday next weekend, and I\u2019m glad to just admit I\u2019m going to be 60, and leave the past decade behind. Quite a lot happened in my 50s.\u201d<\/p>\n This is something of an understatement. Not long before her 50th birthday, Nardini\u2019s beloved father, Aldo, died. She has previously said that her family could have been in The Godfather \u2013 not because of any crime links but because of all the internal feuding.<\/p>\n \u201cDid I really say that? Well, my dad was definitely the don.\u201d<\/p>\n Aldo was the co-founder of Nardini\u2019s ice-cream palace, a white art deco cafe on the seafront at Largs in Ayrshire. I can still recall its monumental knickerbocker glories, the highlight of summer day trips.<\/p>\n In the aftermath of grief, her marriage to the restaurateur Ivan Stein ended. The couple had moved back to Glasgow from London in 2009 with their young daughter, Claudia. \u201cMy husband was retraining to be a chef and I wanted to be close to my family,\u201d she says.<\/p>\n <\/span>\u2018A different strength has come through\u2019 \u2026. Nardini at home in Glasgow.<\/span> Photograph: Murdo MacLeod\/The Guardian<\/p>\n Stein went on to launch The Gannet, one of the most stellar Glasgow restaurant successes of recent years. I suggest it must have been great fun to have had a ringside seat during its glory years.<\/p>\n \u201cWell, I had a little child, so I was in the house most of the time.\u201d<\/p>\n It was ironic that she married someone who was in the same business as her family. \u201cYes, my father had really long hours as well. So, I understood it.\u201d<\/p>\n There is a significant pause. \u201cA chef and an actress \u2026 perhaps it\u2019s just not a good idea.\u201d<\/p>\n She says it in such a deadpan way that I start to laugh, and then so does she.<\/p>\n \u201cWe\u2019re fine. Sometimes, things don\u2019t work out and you just have to get on with it.\u201d<\/p>\n Then, summoned for her first post-50 NHS mammogram, she was diagnosed with breast cancer, which had spread to one lymph node. She underwent a mastectomy and breast reconstruction.<\/p>\n \u201cWhen I was diagnosed, I felt that it had happened because my heart was broken. It felt it was connected to what I had gone through in my life. And I\u2019ve talked to quite a few people who have felt the same thing about their cancer. I felt it came from an emotional place.\u201d<\/p>\n double quotation markWhen I was diagnosed with breast cancer, I felt that it had happened because my heart was broken<\/p>\n She considers herself \u201cvery lucky\u201d because the cancer was caught early and she didn\u2019t need to have chemotherapy.<\/p>\n \u201cI knew quite quickly that it wasn\u2019t going to kill me and I was going to be OK. And once it was done and I\u2019d been through this treatment, I felt it had been dealt with physically, but not emotionally.\u201d<\/p>\n How did it affect her? She leaves the room and returns with a beautiful canvas, one of a series of colourful portraits of women she painted during lockdown. The woman has had her breast removed and the space is adorned with red roses.<\/p>\n \u201cAs a woman, to lose your breast is a very profound thing. The way I\u2019d previously been recognised by the public, it was very sexualised. Then suddenly to lose that part of yourself is very challenging. It changes your relationship with yourself, and not in a negative way.\u201d<\/p>\n She says she has a new appreciation for what the human body can withstand. \u201cThe narrative becomes: \u2018I was ill; now I\u2019m healthy. I have survived this. A different strength has come through. My sexuality is still here, but it\u2019s different because of that experience.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n All these events would test anyone\u2019s emotional resources and, in the midst of it, Nardini realised that she needed help. \u201cThere was just so much happening. My marriage, my dad, both things kind of dissolved at a similar time. I was very close to my dad \u2013 he was a massive character, and that was mixed in with the grief of a marriage failing, ending. And then the breast cancer. It was just too much for me to process.\u201d<\/p>\n After seeing a therapist and experiencing first-hand the difference it could make, she started her own training \u2013 but negative things kept on happening. First came lockdown, then her mother died in 2022, and then her aunt, to whom she was very close. \u201cBecause I\u2019d been hit with a further emotional onslaught, training took me a while.\u201d She finally qualified in 2024.<\/p>\n \u201cIf you\u2019ve lived a life and you\u2019ve been through stuff yourself, you are going to have more empathy for people who are going through similar things. Sometimes, I think if you are a therapist and you\u2019ve never experienced low mood or anxiety, how can you share about it or talk about it with someone who\u2019s going through it?\u201d<\/p>\n Nardini tells me that as a therapist, she has a supervisor to enhance her practice, which has helped her greatly. \u201cMine has been teaching me about schema, the self-defeating patterns of your life. Once you understand where those are coming from, it\u2019s inspiring, and you can say: \u2018OK, now I know that\u2019s not my stuff any more.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n So, what was her stuff?<\/p>\n \u201cMy stuff was probably being the only girl in quite a strong male family. I also lost my brother Pietro in a car accident when I was in my teens. I think I was just numb for several years.\u201d<\/p>\n <\/span>\u2018I\u2019ve been on two online dates in 10 years \u2013 one with a psychiatrist.\u2019<\/span> Photograph: Murdo MacLeod\/The Guardian<\/p>\n When she was 21, Nardini started having panic attacks. \u201cI remember standing outside the drama school building in Glasgow and suddenly my heart was beating really fast and the sky went really big and I felt this overwhelming fear. And I believe it was because I hadn\u2019t allowed myself to fully experience my grief.\u201d<\/p>\n Learning the impact of unexpressed emotions first-hand has had a big impact on her therapeutic approach. \u201cClients will come to me and say: \u2018Oh, I just block that out\u2019; or, \u2018It just all goes over my head.\u2019 I tell them: \u2018No, you have got to bring it into the light because that\u2019s the stuff that stopping you from living a happy and healthy life.\u2019\u201d<\/p>\n Is being a therapist so very different from being an actor, in the sense that you are drawing on your own experience? \u201cTo be a therapist, you\u2019re listening to a person talking about their challenges. Being an actor, you go on a kind of psychological journey. So, yes, there are similarities.\u201d<\/p>\n Did she enjoy being famous? \u201cWell, for all of us on the cast, it was our first big job. We were all making money so we had great fun. We got invited everywhere and had a fantastic time. We all got on great.\u201d<\/p>\n However, she did not enjoy being recognised by the public. \u201cI\u2019d be out with my mum and someone would come barging up and ignore her, just focusing on me. I found that disconcerting. I don\u2019t miss that. Also, if you\u2019ve been in the public eye, people think they can ask you questions about stuff that\u2019s really private.\u201d<\/p>\n Now that Nardini is single, this has added an unwelcome dimension to the prospect of dating. \u201cI\u2019ve been on two online dates in 10 years. One was with a psychiatrist, and we just didn\u2019t fancy each other. The other was with a guy who had Googled the hell out of me. He was bringing up all this stuff about my family. I asked him: \u2018Exactly how long did you spend researching me?!\u2019 After that, I was like: I don\u2019t know about this.\u201d<\/p>\n It made her wary. \u201cRight now, I\u2019m glad that I don\u2019t have a partner, but it has taken a long time to get to this point. A lot of your identity is wrapped up in who you\u2019re married to.\u201d<\/p>\n Nardini says she is not entirely against the idea of meeting someone new. \u201cBut he\u2019d have to be quite some guy. Because right now I am really happy. I have a social life. I have a professional life and I feel pretty content. I don\u2019t want any problems coming into my life. I don\u2019t want anyone coming in and telling me what to do, what to eat, what to watch on the telly. You become very contented in your own space. You know, sometimes I think I\u2019d kind of like it, but I\u2019d like it to be with someone amazing.\u201d<\/p>\n Recently, she asked one of her clients if they would give up their job if they won the lottery. The client said they would. \u201cSee, that\u2019s the thing. I wouldn\u2019t stop working. I would want to keep doing what I\u2019m doing now. Being a therapist. My acting life is quieter now, but people still come to me with small parts. So I\u2019d like to keep doing that too. Doing it all is what makes me tick. It\u2019s been a good move for me.\u201d<\/p>\n Despite everything, Nardini still feels lucky.<\/p>\n This Life is available now on BBC iPlayer for its 30th anniversary<\/p>\n Do you have an opinion on the issues raised in this article? If you would like to submit a response of up to 300 words by email to be considered for publication in our letters section, please click here<\/strong><\/em><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":" Almost 30 years ago, not long after the final episode of This Life, the BBC series that launched Daniela Nardini\u2019s career, I interviewed her at a swanky hotel in Covent Garden, London. 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